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Just another phony war

For Aesop: seen this one yet? Asking for a friend, that’s all.

Merkel Spills Beans on How U.S. and NATO Partners Planned War in Ukraine Against Russia

It is becoming irrefutably clear that the United States and its NATO partners have been planning for many years for the current war in the Ukraine against Russia. That fact makes the prospects for peace all the more elusive. How to negotiate with a mindset that is so deeply invested and ingrained with belligerence?

Western governments and media accuse Russia of “unprovoked aggression” against Ukraine and are clamoring for Moscow to hand over eye-watering financial compensation as well as face war crimes prosecutions.

The bitter irony is that the war in Ukraine, which is dangerously escalating and could spiral into a nuclear cataclysm, was sown by the United States and its accomplices. It is the West that bears ultimate responsibility for this abysmal situation, not Russia.

Former German Chancellor Angela Merkel (2005-2021) is the latest Western source to come clean or let their guard down. She disclosed in a recent interview with Der Spiegel the real roots of the war.

Merkel’s reprehensible revelation is inadvertent. She refers to appeasing the Ukrainian regime as a way to eventually build up its fighting strength against Russia. She invokes this reasoning as a way to justify why she objected to Ukraine’s earlier membership of the NATO alliance in 2008. The fact of membership wasn’t wrong, it was just a matter of wrong timing, according to Merkel.

As respected independent military analyst Scott Ritter points out, Merkel also knew that the Kiev regime installed by the CIA-backed coup d’état in 2014 was not interested in a peaceful resolution of the civil war in that country.

The unspoken policy in Berlin was all about buying time for the anticipated aggression against Russia. This was in spite of the fact that Germany along with France was supposed to be a guarantor of the Minsk peace agreements negotiated in 2014 and 2015.

In other words, Ukraine was primed for war against Russia from 2014 onwards.

Merkel’s admission is therefore really a confession of Western duplicity towards Russia, as Ritter astutely notes.

Plenty more at the link, all of it damning for the unabashedly evil Western manipulators running this whole shitshow. While I do have sympathy for the workaday Ukrainians suffering through this, I still don’t give a rat’s patoot about the fate of Ukraine’s current kleptocracy, given how it has functioned for many years now as basically a Democrat Party ATM. And though I harbor neither affection nor allegiance for Pooty-Poot (as the ridiculous George W Bush called him), if he takes Zelensky and his corrupt cabal down hard, I won’t be shedding any tears over it.

(Via Dave Renegade)

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Aesop

Before I even dig into it in depth and detail, it already fails the 10′ smell test in the following ways:

1) Merkel is a trusted source on anything since…when, exactly?

2) Planning “for many years”?? Stumblefuck Poopypants was only crowned emperor a year and a half ago, when last I looked. So this started under Trump?
Obozo?
Shrub?
Fat Bill?
Srsly?
Now do chem-trails, Bigfoot, the Easter Bunny, and fake moon landings.

3) I seem to recall we were a tad busy with actual wars from about 9/12/01-about a year ago. We were planning to gin up a war with Russia because…reasons?

4) We “planned this for years” and cleverly set it up so that within the first 24 hours Ukraine nearly collapsed, and it took weeks and months to get them serious weapons and resupplies??
Pick one: Either we pulled this out of our asses after the fact, or we would have pre-positioned shit-tons of equipment “for years”. You can have one or the other. Not both.

That’s in 5 seconds of applying common sense, and granting the premise, which is the simplest way to let bullshit fall from its own weight.

I’m literally about to head out for dinner, but I’ll give it a serious look-over later tonight.

But even a h.s. freshman JROTC student in his second week of class would tell you this whole thing sounds like they’re trying to sell you ten pounds of shit in a five pound bag, calling it steak, and trying to get $8/lb for it.

As Wilford Brimley told the deputy looking for the reward for Sonny Steele in <i>The Electric Horseman</i>, “I wouldn’t get my hopes up.”

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Barry

I agree with Aesop. I can’t read german well enough to read the original article, but what is referenced doesn’t pass the silly test, I.E. it’s proof of nothing.

Ukraine is corrupt. The russians are corrupt. And its clear the government of the USA is corrupt.

I wouldn’t send a nickel to Ukraine in spite of the fact that I personally like the Ukrainian people. But that doesn’t change the facts:

The russians invaded Ukraine. They did so because the fascist dictator, putin, desires to resurrect the old empire. All attempts to put lipstick on that pig are just fairy tales. They are a decrepit country with nukes. Their military is a conscripted joke, barely functional even when the country they invade is on their border. The Ukraine, while propped up with our money and weapons, is nearly 1/4 the population of russia. The slam dunk that wasn’t, because the corrupt oligarchy of russia is inept.

MarkMatis

The EU and NATO are also terminally corrupt as well!

Barry

Yes, and add the UN and WHO.

kennycan

You’re #2 is ridiculous. Stumblefuck poopy pants is 0 v2.0.

So yes. It goes at least that far back.

But wait, it DOES go back to BJ.

Read Kennan and Schlafly on NATO expansion in 1998. It definitely goes back to BJ in 1994.

I will post the relevant articles soon.

Barry

Kenny, NATO is free to expand as far and wide as it likes. That is freedom.

kennycan

Maybe it can, but explain why it SHOULD.

It’s purpose was over by as early as 1994. It should have been terminated, not expanded.

Plus moving military assets ever closer to a country is a cassus belli. We saw that in Cuba. We saw that with Israel 1967.

Face it. There was no other good reason to start expanding NATO in the 90s than to provoke a response from Russia that could be used as an excuse to eventually get another War there. This is how the MIC and Deep State work. Perpetual wars are the aim, as it is very lucrative for looting the American Treasury (and other treasuries).

NATO is the military wing of the Deep State, and like the FBI, NATO Delenda Est.

But you see that with the FBI but not with Russia. If you were Russia and you saw what they did in former Yugoslavia what would you think? How would you react to the overthrow of Qadaffy, our Ally in the WoT (not a particularly valuable Ally but at least he renounced Jihad and paid restitution), on behalf of Jihadists?

In DC they should be turning to look at each other, dressed as Nazis, and then asking “Are we the Baddies?”.

Last edited 1 month ago by kennycan
Barry

I don’t need to explain why it should. I only need to explain why it’s no excuse for putin/russia to invade a country on it’s border, that is not a member of NATO, and has never threatened the russians.

The Ukraine even gave up the nukes on their territory, with guarantee’s of protection form the russians and Americans.

Putin/Russia is not threatened by NATO. It has never been a threat to Russia. Libya has nothing to do with it.

NATO prevents Russia from expanding it’s iron grip on the countries surrounding it, and putin wants those back in the soviet sphere. That’s it. All of it.

Putin is a KGB murderer and torturer, russian leader of the red factions in germany and italy that murder and maim. His grandfather was the cook for both lenin and stalin. It would be no surprise to anyone that reads about the man that he desires to rule the former Soviet Empire, by any means.

Putins problem is putin believed his own propaganda. The russians are a 3rd world military with nukes and are incapable of mounting a winning strategy on their own border. Thus we have what will soon be a year long war. Can the russians “win”? Of course. At what cost?

kennycan

Cassus Belli. An act of War.

Russia invaded for the same reason Israel did in 1967.

Barry

No, they didn’t. It’s pure fantasy.

kennycan

You’re simply wrong. There is no other reason to expand NATO. It had no purpose after the Soviet Union disappeared.

So its expansion could only be as a way to expand US Sphere of Influence into Russia. That’s what happens when you name an “enemy”.

That’s the heart of the Russia Russia Russia Collusion with Trump. They know there’s an ingrained misperception about Russia left over from the Cold War they can exploit.

Aesop

Okay, read it.

1) It’s a bigger pile of shit than I suspected at first.
2) The translated link at Der Spiegel, far from “spilling any beans”, leads to one where Frau Farbissina Merkel saying she regrets Germany didn’t pony up 2% of its GDP far earlier, and considers that a failure on her part during her time as PM. If someone can pry out a link to WTF they meant to link to, post it. The one they supplied themselves was horseshit.
3) The linked editorial was suspect as soon as I got to the quote “respected independent military analyst Scott Ritter”. He’s a “respected independent military analyst” like James Comey was a “non-partisan even-handed FBI Director”. Ritter was one of the leading proponents for WMDs in Iraq, and later loudly proclaimed the US would never be able to militarily conquer and occupy Baghdad. (Which, in fact, took a bare few weeks.) After that, he became one of the loudest proponents for the idea that there were never any WMDs in Iraq. He’s nothing but a shit-talking opportunist, and operates entirely on his own delusional reality, which life in the real world seldom supports. He should have been shit-canned from the Marines before he made captain, but evidently, the intel weenies were pretty hard up for anyone who wanted the job.
4) By 2014, Putin had already illegally annexed Crimea, violating their own agreements when Ukraine gave up its Soviet-era nukes (biggest strategic blunder of the 20th century, obviously). Vlad then sent airborne and Spetsnaz troops into the Donbas in civilian clothes, and pretended they were a popular uprising against Kiev, in the most obvious fraud since Hitler’s Operation Canned Goods in Poland in 1939. That may have had a wee bit to do with why no one in NATO was buying Vlad’s bullshit way back when, or any time since.
5) In all, the editorial in question is screed masquerading as something new, rather than simply a slightly re-worked FSB press release from last February on why Putin had no choice but to try and conquer Ukraine by invading for a third time in 8 years, because their serial annexations, threats, and invasions hadn’t resulted in Ukraine welcoming them like a long-lost lover.
The only difference between Vlad and an abusive boyfriend who won’t take “no” for an answer from his ex- is simply one of scale and scope of the infuriated slaughter that ensues.
6) The coup in Kiev resulted in massive rearmament by Ukraine, because
a) they had finally dumped the latest in an unbroken line of leadership that had been sucking Moscow’s ass non-stop since independence in 1991, and
b) they’d already been invaded by Russia twice in the prior year, and Putin was already threatening and blustering to take even more. Bithcing about that, as the editorial screed attempts, is like taking a homeowner whose home has been invaded, and his wife and daughters ass-raped in front of him, twice, for daring to buy himself a gun. This is pure Russian propaganda and drivel.
7) They then go on to bitching that Ukraine is now striking targets inside Russia, after 9 months of Russia fucking up anything they can hit with a pulse inside Ukraine. Usually, you only hear “bitch-ass niggers”, to use Dave Chapelle’s notable description, whining when the guy they’re robbing has the unmitigated gall to shoot them back in their own ass, but now this load of codswallop wants to carp because Ukraine is dealing Russia the same shit-sandwich they took without escalation for months on end. It’s no wonder none of their bitch-ass whing pussies had the balls to sign the piece, but instead posted it as an anonymous editorial, because that kind of position is quite obviously nothing other than a load of total horseshit.
8) Someone should send them a calendar, because the West being pissed off with Russia for their stunts in 2014 amounts to a tad over 7 years when the war broke out, which is not, as this screed attempts to characterize it, something that has persisted “for over a decade, if not longer”. Evidently they’re no better at calendar math than they are at common sense.

I hope that wasn’t too subtle a fisking of that floating butt-nugget piece. This is why, when I see anything similar, the best thing to do with it is jiggle the handle and flush again.

And Barry is mostly right. Vlad is a dictatorial asshole with delusions of former Soviet grandeur, and both governments there, as well as our own are corrupt beyond belief. The one indisputable fact about Zelensky is that he isn’t Moscow’s bitch, which is a first for anyone running Ukraine since they became independent over 30 years ago. The only reason I support the Ukrainian response is because I think the people of Ukraine have the right to pick their own rulers, and have proven worthy of as much support as they can make use of, but unlike Barry, I think sending them our munitions rusting away into obsolescence is a worthy expenditure, because anything that hamstrings Russia’s militaristic adventurism increases world peace in the long run, and embarrasses them on the world stage in the short run.
A crippled Russia is a happy European continent. And Vlad ain’t gonna live forever.
I wouldn’t send them a single soldier in direct support, but handing the guns and bullets, and letting them do the Russian-hunting shooting, is perfectly splendid, and ought to be encouraged to the fullest extent, until they get the hint, and scuttle back to actual Russia. You might have thought their own Afghanistan experience would still be fresh enough in Russians’ minds, but evidently, you’d be wrong about that.
Continual punches in the nose, and the dick, should refresh their recollection, and Ukraine seems more than happy and capable of doing it, ad infinitum.
Best Wishes to them in that endeavor.

Barry

Very good. You have proven what I knew was likely regarding the article.

I should clarify on my lack of support for the Ukraine. That is a direct result of not trusting the assholes currently installed at the top of the government. Since I know that of every dollar sent a large proportion goes into bank accounts, I’m opposed. Were a reasonably honest government in place on our side I would undoubtedly feel differently.

Aesop

Understood.
I’ve carefully differentiated my own support between Ukrainians in general, rather than any Zelensky-mania, for a variety of reasons. Not least of which is that governments come and go, but borders don’t.
But to be fair, pretty much any government the U.S. has ever supported, anywhere, 1900-present, has turned out to be corrupt. (Philippines, Iran, anything in Africa, Central, or South America, etc. ad infinitum). Holding that against Ukraine, in this instance, seems rather petty and short-sighted, given the circumstances. That’s also why I’d rather see them handed arms and ammunition, rather than pallets of cash. The former can be turned in the latter, but not so much when you’re under daily attack by a power with four to ten times your strength, on paper.

Barry

Yea, add South Korea and Vietnam to that list where we sent dollars, hardware and military men. Both were corrupt, but I’ve never regretted our saving SK or our attempt to save SV. I do regret we throw the lives away a 2nd time in a place like Vietnam.

kennycan

Borders change all the time.

Or do you want America to go back to its original borders?

Wilsonian Democrats talk like you do.

Ukraine was never a country. It’s borders have been drawn by whichever country controlled it since the Mongols overran the Kievan Rus.

Barry

Borders change all the time.
So what Kenny?

Borders are also defended all the time. Or do you want America to go back to its original borders?

kennycan

Why should we cripple a Nuclear State?

Your hatred of Russia, when Ukraine is equally bad, is simple bigotry. Do you use ‘nekukturny’ as an ironic handle?

Barry

when Ukraine is equally bad

You know better than that. To list the atrocities committed by the russians since 1917 would require most of the evening.

Not to mention the murder and purposeful starvation of the Ukrainians by the russians.

Do I hate Russia?
Damn right I do. They are responsible for just about every evil in the world today. Putin is an evil KGB torturing and murdering bastard.

kennycan

The Ukrainians were Commies too. They aided the Holodomor. They were as guilty of the atrocities as anyone.

Face it. It’s NOT inherently Russian. It’s inherently COMMUNISTS.

Barry

It’s inherently COMMUNISTS.

Sure. And it was the russians that forced that upon the Soviet controlled countries. What happened when the Ukraine threw off the yokes of communist russia?

They aided the Holodomor.
Sure, just as the Vichy aided the germans. There are bad actors in every country. Sans the russians the starvation and murder of the Ukrainians would not have happened. That is a fact.

Trying to prove Ukraine is equally bad as russia is a losing proposition. Russia, AKA “Evil Empire” is responsible for all the corruption, death, and destruction in eastern Europe. Are you suggesting Poland, Latvia, etc are all as evil as the russians?

There is no excuse for what the feckless, corrupt, evil russians are doing in and to the Ukraine.

kennycan

No Barry, the Ukrainians had COMMUNISTS who joined the Bolsheviks in subjugating Ukraine.

The Evil Empire was the Soviet Union.

And yes, the Vichy DID aid the Germans. That is what collaborators do. Since the Coup in 2014 the Collaborators are the Puppet Regime the Deep State installed in Ukraine.

They are as Evil as Deep State itself. So evil that they were the ones laundering money for our Deep State Politicians in the form of Aid, and now we learn, through FTX and bitcoin schemes.

Without a War, how can the “Aid” be funneled there and then recycled back.

It’s an evil, vicious Scam to rob Americans blind, and the Ukrainians are Just In On It, at least at the Governmental Level installed by the Maidan Coup.

Barry

Geez Kenny, you’re torturing me.

The Evil Empire was the Soviet Union.
The russians were the Soviet union. Every bit of it was run by the russians.

Without a War, how can the “Aid” be funneled there and then recycled back.
Well, it seems the biden clan and the rest of the pols were doing just fine without a war, or did you miss that? Seriously, you’re going to suggest that money wasn’t getting funneled to the Ukraine and back without a war?

Yes, they are all evil. Ours, theirs, all of them. On that we agree. WW3 being pushed by NATO/Putin/Merkel? No. Why would they when they had a good thing going? No one knows the outcome of a war, particularly a war with a nuclear power.

kennycan

Nope,the Communists were the Soviet Union abd the Coimmunists camefrom ALL the countries the Soviets eventually controlled.

Ever heard of the East German Stasi? Were they Russians?

Individual Ukrainians were every bit as responsible for Soviet atrocities as any Russian. There were atrocities committed by Polish Communists, and Latvian Communists and Georgian Communists and Czech Communists as well.

It was ALL about the Communism.

The Marxists (Commies and Fascists) took Mass Graves to a whole other level in the 20th Century and that spanned a diverse group such as Germans (Hitler), Italians (Mussolini), Russians (Stalin), Chinese (Mao), Koreans (the Kims), Vietnamese (Ho Chi Minh), Cambodians (Pol Pot), Angolans, Cubans (Castro and Che) and a whole host of others. Blaming Communism, when it was Germans (Marx and Engels) who thought of it and did the major part of their work in London, on Russians is wrong. Russians were victims of Communism as much as any other peoples were. And here’s the scary part: Commies run DC now. So, are you going to blame the coming slaughters here on Russians?

The Russians prior to the Soviet takeover were no more brutal than anyone else.

Look at the massacres Hessians and British committed in America. Or the (Hungarian?) that served as the source for the Count Dracula stories. Or the Spanish Inquisition

Brutality and atrocities were endemic throughout Europe, The Russians certainly had no monopoly on it.

The Russians are no worse a people than the Ukrainians. Western Europe in the form of France and UK may have a little better rep because of their Enlightenment Values that were more ensconced in their History than much of the rest of Europe. Overall the Anglo-Saxon World is the only one to rise to the heights above everyone else when it comes to Freedom and it only shines at all here in the US. But it’s being extinguished.

So stop blaming Russians and blame the real Culprits. Communists.

kennycan

I’m glad to see the author wrote Kiev.

My late 60s Websters Dictionary says that in American English the city is written as Kiev.

I’m tired of the State Department changing American English for political reasons.
Especially since I mostly disagree with the reasons and the politics.

kennycan

Written in 1998, can someone tell me what Kennan and Schlafly got wrong?

Note that Schlafly was a big Trump supporter.
George Kennan, 1998 interview on NATO expansion – Times of Gold

Will America Be Caught in Clinton’s ‘Web’? — April 1998 Phyllis Schlafly Report (eagleforum.org)

Phyllis Schlafly Makes the Case for President Trump (breitbart.com)

Oh, and can someone tell me which NATO nation Bosnia, Serbia or Libya attacked?

You may not like Russia under Putin. I don’t like dictators. But we have supported many for strategic reasons. I don’t even recommend supporting Putin. But our use of NATO as an offensive force in the hands of Deep State is very troubling as an American

I just ask that you put yourself into his shoes as the Leader of Russia and ask yourself this: If I were to put Russia First and I were faced with the Dem Policies towards me since BJ, through 0bambam and now Biteme what would I be doing to protect my country?”

Barry

“…what would I be doing to protect my country?”

Well, if you had brains, the last thing you would do is attack the Ukraine, a country that has not caused any issue or threat to you.

Which means Putin has no brains, or, he attacked Ukraine for another reason. Putin has brains, not much but some. The problem is putin has in fact made russia weaker and less stable, which is the opposite of “protect my country”.

You cannot make a case for attacking the Ukraine as providing any protection to russia. Every male under 35 is trying to get out of there. 4-6 million russians have left the country in 2022. More will leave in 2023 and more will die in putins stupid invasion. Some protective measure.

Aesop

Let’s not leave out what wonders Putey Poot’s done for the size of his Navy (due to the new Black Sea submarine fleet), his stock of missiles and artillery shells, and the halving of his actual running tank inventory since February, not to mention demonstrating to the entire watching world what incompetent boobs the Russian military is composed of.

That will turn out well with Russia’s millennia-long frenemy watching intently from Beijing, and a host of minority-Russian -stans itching for independence too.

Barry

Well, all the putin bots (not Kenny) keep claiming the russians have an endless supply of arms. That, combined with putins superior (hitler like even) military tactics guarantee a quick win.

Or something. Any day now. Soon.

Misha

If anybody still cares, the “confusion” about Merkel’s remarks seems to stem from the article linked not linking to the actual interview in Die Zeit which is hidden behind a paywall. Fortunately, the Internets have ways around that, so here’s the actual link to the original article.

It’s in German, my apologies, but I actually speak the language fluently, and I can confirm that Ms. “How is She a Credible Source In Spite of Being One of the Four Leaders Involved in the Actual Mink Accord Negotiations?” Merkel said exactly what the article linked by you stated that she said.

More specifically, and again, I speak German, she said:

“…and the Minsk Accords of 2014 was an attempt to buy time for Ukraine. And they also spent this time to get stronger, as you can see today. The Ukraine from 2014/1015 isn’t the Ukraine from today. As one might have observed from the fights around Debaltsevo in the beginning of 2015, Putin would have been able to easily overrun it at the time. And I seriously doubt that the NATO states had been able to do as much as much then as now in order to assist Ukraine.”

But people in the West don’t care about facts, they only hear what they want to hear, so why do I even bother.

Congrats, Aesop, you’re going to be just as right about this as you were about the WuFlu ending us all due to an impossible swamping of ICUs and not enough ventilators, yet here we are.

Keep it up and you’ll be right eventually. About something. I’m sure of it.

Barry

Nice to see you commenting, Misha.

The headline is “Merkel Spills Beans on How U.S. and NATO Partners Planned War in Ukraine Against Russia”. I’m not seeing the quoted passage of Merkel as providing evidence of this “war planning”. I’m not understanding how the West/NATO managed to force Putin into invading Ukraine, particularly in light of when these invasions began, 2014.

I have no great love for NATO, but that is primarily because it was paid for by us (primarily), not those being protected, and because like all govco operations it is corrupt to the core. OTOH, countries can and do align with treaties for protection and I’ll be damned if I give russia/putin authority over that.

I’m not seeing anything here, or elsewhere, that gives legitimate cause or excuse for the russians to invade the Ukraine.

kennycan

As has been repeatedly pointed out, the Coup in 2014 is one of the key events.

As respected independent military analyst Scott Ritter points out, Merkel also knew that the Kiev regime installed by the CIA-backed coup d’état in 2014 was not interested in a peaceful resolution of the civil war in that country.

The unspoken policy in Berlin was all about buying time for the anticipated aggression against Russia. 

As is noted further in the actual Scot Ritter link:

Russia had been duped into believing there was a diplomatic solution to the violence that had broken out in the Donbass region of eastern Ukraine in the aftermath of the 2014 U.S.-backed Maidan coup in Kiev.

Once the Coup was run in 2014, after having seen how NATO operated in the former Yugoslavia, and even more importantly, how NATO threw their weight in with Jihadists and overthrew Qadaffy in 2011, the writing was on the wall. Putin knew all about the Benghazi gun running to Syria as well. Finally Putin could observe the 0 Admin actions relating to helping Iran go nuclear. He also almost certainly knew about the mass bribery of Joetato and many others in Ukraine.

He correctly observed that our Deep State, under 0 and Clinton, were even MORE radical than they had been under BJ, and that the GOPe had joined in.

Washington DC under 0bambam had elevated the threat levels to the highest it had ever been.

So he immediately moved to secure the Crimea and the crucial military base there.

Seeing this move, Deep State realized that Ukraine could not fight this proxy war at that time. They had moved too early, but they had to because the duly elected Ukrainian President was moving away from the EU and TO Russia. So they had to run the Coup and hope Putin did nothing. Putin called that bluff.

So they began negotiations and Putin and Russia was again reassured on the Donbas and other issues.

AS the article points out, the intention all along was to renege on that Treaty as soon as possible once they felt Ukraine was strong enough to take Russia on again.

They then reneged on it and started killing ethnic Russians in the Donbas anyway.

But along comes Trump, and Putin thinks, “OK finally we have a normal leader there, and he isn’t afraid to play hardball. So I have to back off, knowing they won’t do anything radical now under Trump”.

What would you think he said when Trump was taken out in a Coup by the very same Radical Group that was behind 0bambam and Crooked Clinton?

SteveF

respected independent military analyst Scott Ritter

Would that be the highly respected Scott Ritter who was a UN arms inspector in Iraq in the 1990s, who was hard-charging about all of the WMD violations … until all of a sudden he wasn’t?

And a few years later he fell for a police sting, attempting to solicit an underage girl?

Which led to questions about what blackmail Saddam might have obtained on him in Iraq?

The same Scott Ritter who fell into another sting for, again, attempting to solicit sex from an underage girl?

That Scott Ritter?

Questionable dating habits don’t necessarily impede his judgment on WMD construction or military buildups, but they do raise doubts about whether he’s able to voice his honest appraisal of what he sees or whether his voiced opinions are being controlled by blackmailers.

kennycan

Perhaps, but can you find fault in what he wrote?

He’s not the only one to make this observation.

Oh, and besides the quote, none of the rest of that analysis came from Ritter. It came from my own readings of the situation.

Ukraine is a Deep State Scam.

Barry

I was going to point out the same thing. If you are using that bastard for information you’re in trouble.

Everything he writes is wrong. You take a series of events and try to mold them to your view. There is near zero evidence that NATO was trying to provoke a nuclear Russia into WW3. I do recall when obama was bending over and sending a message to putin that he would be more “flexible” after the election though.

The entirety of the european left (75% of the europeans) have been bending over for the russians for 50+ years. Just look at where they were getting their energy from, enriching the Putin cabal.

You have to torture the facts to fit them into your view.

kennycan

Like I said. He’s hardly the only source here.

Even Sarah Hoyt is starting to question this whole canard.

It’s a Deep State Con and like people had a blind spot for WuFlu, people have a blind spot to Russia because they basically just don’t like Russians.

I find Russians no more nor less a care of mine than any other ethnic group. Ukraine’s Government though has proven itself to be allied with Deep State.

Deep State is evil and America’s enemy. Anyone willing to throw in with them cannot be good.

Barry

Ukraine is a Deep State Scam.

No one is arguing it’s not. We’re arguing it already was, and there was no need to start a war to scam the Americans out of their money. It was already occurring in massive amounts. You keep pretending Putin had no choice. He made a choice, and chose poorly.

kennycan

There are 68 BILLION reasons to start a War in Deep State’s eyes. With potentially hundreds of billions more and with success in installing a Puppet in Russia, we could be talking Trillions.

Before this the scamming was low scale. A few billion here and there. Now it’s Iraq/Afghanistan levels and those scams had to be replaced.

kennycan

Another key point:

…the fact that Merkel knew that inviting Ukraine into NATO would trigger a Russian military response.

Rather than reject this possibility altogether, Merkel instead pursued a policy designed to make Ukraine capable of withstanding such an attack.

War, it seems, was the only option Russia’s opponents had ever considered.

In 2016 Crooked was supposed to seal the deal on all of these types of things, by crushing the third blind mice the Republicans were trying to serve up, Jeb Bush.

Instead Trump the Mule came along and upset the Foundation’s calculations. Well, now that Trump was gone, the Plans went forward.

Barry

Those “plans” you speak of are fantasy Kenny. As I said above, the euro’s and obama nave been bending over for the russians, not starting WW3.

kennycan

False.

What does “wait until Ukraine is strong before pressuring Russia again with Ukraine as proxy” don’t you get?

Misha makes more sense.

This info is not taken in a vacuum. Everyone from Schlafly and Kennan to Meirsheimer and Rand Paul have issues with our strategic approach to Eastern Europe going back to 1o94. Many, many others as well.

Given the Revelations over that time period about how corrupt our MeoCon/Dem Alliance and the Brussels Gang are now, it’s hardly a stretch to think they wanted this War as part of The Great Reset.

They’re literally.telling you what they’re doing and you choose to look at spin instead.

kennycan

Our goal is Regime Change in Russia.

Tell me one instance where Regime Change in Post Cold War America has worked.out well for the average American.

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