GIVE TIL IT HURTS!

Speculation Concerning an Oddity of Behavior

Why is it that many of the most devout Christians constantly reassure themselves of their faith, that they know it’s true, that they know everything is in God’s or Jesus’s loving hands?

Muslims do much the same, as do some Hindus in the US. (Adjusting for cultural and religious differences.)

Can you imagine the same concerning something that can be demonstrated as being true?

Gravity loves me, this I know!
Newton’s apple tells me so.
Praise Gravity every day
So our stuff won’t float away.

No, of course not.

Likewise for constant assertions that “My faith in God is at the center of everything I do.” “Every decision I make, I ask myself what is the best way to honor God.”

Can you imagine the same concerning other fundamental aspects of your being? “First and foremost I am a eukaryote. Don’t ask me to do anything without keeping that in mind.”

My proposed explanation: The devout know deep down that their religion isn’t really true. They can’t accept this, so they aver their faith ever louder to drown out their doubts.

There may be some elements of cosmological truth if you close one eye and squint with the other, but the explanations of the world invented by Bronze Age nomads do not suit the modern world at all. The holy works of various religions may contain useful advice for living your life and for living with other people. There’s a lot of bad advice in there, too, so at best that’s a wash if you’re trying to live your life strictly in accordance with your religion.

5
2
2 4 votes
Article Rating
39 Comments
Oldest
Newest Most Voted
Inline Feedbacks
View all comments
Barry

The devout know deep down that their religion isn’t really true.

I’d quibble with that a bit and say “The devout are afraid that their religion isn’t really true“.

OTOH, while not religious, I cannot look around and into the night sky and think it just “happened because”. IMO, we’re not equipped to understand anything of why we/the universe(s) are here.

6
1
Botched_Lobotomy

It’s called praying and your example sounds like its based on a liturgy said in a Church. Religious people do it to communicate with God and give Him thanks. No one just walks around public saying the Stuart Smalley daily affirmation.

Weird that you’re obsessed with religious people when you say you don’t believe. What do you care what they do? Putting other people down just so you can feel superior is pretty sad. You may want to look inside yourself to figure out what is missing in your life that you need to insult other people in order to feel better.

As for the value of religion, if nothing else, it provides millions of people with a moral and ethical foundation on which to live their lives. When people do not have a foundation or an understanding of right and wrong you get places like Hollywood and Washington DC and the disgusting degenerate Leftist culture that permeates today’s society.

Merry Christmas

26
9
Botched_Lobotomy

Yes, it is too late. As John Adams said, “our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other.” We have proven him correct.

Christian founded America was the most free society and probably had the best form of government for the people thus far. And yet that was corrupted and destroyed in a few centuries. As Mr. Adams foresaw, we needed more God not less. Now we’ll reap what we’ve sown.

12
5
John Wilder

A person without faith attempting to explain faith is like a dolphin trying to explain hang gliding.

27
Botched_Lobotomy

Apparently our fight against the commies is going so well we’re back to punching right again. Its also extremely poor taste so soon after the massacre at the Christmas parade in Waukesha.

5
2
Barry

 Its also extremely poor taste…
When would you find it to be in “good taste”?

4
3
Botched_Lobotomy

Personally I would never find insulting and disparaging Christians based on stereotypes and generalizations to be in good taste. If you mean when is it in good taste to take precious time out of my day to post something that earns me a pat on the head from Leftists, Communists, Antifa, BLM and other atheists, the answer is also never.

While we’re on the topic of speculating about groups of people based on cherry-picked examples, why is it that Leftists, Communists and atheists need to reassure themselves with insipid platitudes, cliches and slogans such as “Trust the Science”, “Black Lives Matter”, “Love is Love”, “Reproductive Rights are Human Rights” and “I believe in science!”

Can you imagine the same concerning something that can be demonstrated as being false?

Wearing cheap cotton masks will stop a microscopic virus!
Shutting down the economy and destroying the middle class is worth it to stop a virus that will kill less than 1% of the population!
We need to mandate that all people including babies are injected with an experimental gene therapy that has never been tested on humans before and we have no idea of the long term effects in order to try and prevent people over 80 from dying of a variant of the flu!
Its not a baby its a clump of cells!

Likewise for constant assertions like “I am science and attacking me is attacking science” from world renowned atheist Anthony Fauci. Or, “97% of scientists dependent on government funding believe that we need to pay more taxes to government to stop climate change.” Or, “We can trust Big Pharma to do what’s best for us so we should immunize them from lawsuits in case they wind up killing us just to make billions of dollars.” Or, “You worship lights in the sky!”

My proposed explanation: Deep down, atheists feel guilty about their sad, degenerate and pointless existence. They are mad at God because they feel guilty about their choices in life. They don’t like that choosing to be homosexuals, child molesters, drug addicts, and baby murderers is considered sinful so they throw temper tantrums like petulant children who can’t have cookies for breakfast.

There may be some atheists who sincerely question God due to some personal hardship. If you close one eye and squint hard enough you can probably find reasons why atheists choose to worship Hollywood idols, Washington bureaucrats and corrupt scientists.

But the explanations for how to live a good life from Leftists, Communists and other atheists do not suit man’s yearning to understand the world and his place in it in today’s age.

10
Barry

There you go again, confusing facts and faith 🙂

Aesop

The trouble with the “Bronze Age nomad” trope you keep trotting out is that the Bronze Age ended 200 years before King David ruled Israel, and 1200 years before Christ’s time, which would put half or more of the Tanakh long after the era you wish to impugn, and rather late in the Iron Age, not any part of the Bronze Age at all, and the entirety of the New Testament, as well as the Hindu texts, were recorded five centuries after even the Iron Age, and the Koran another five centuries after that.

The only “Bronze Age nomad” worthy of the name was Abraham, who in actual fact recorded no holy works anywhere, by any account.

So it would probably be instructive for you, let alone the audience here, before you’re going to dredge up history and attempt to use it as a cudgel, to possess a basic grasp of both the standard accepted demarcations of pre-history, and the actual history itself, of which you’re manifestly and globally ignorant.

But by all means, keep digging, if only for the comedy relief.

So long, and thanks for all the fish!

11
7
Botched_Lobotomy

What’s the logic trail? That humans are constantly learning as their experiences grow over time? No one has disputed that.

The issue is with your need to portray people who believe in religion as Neanderthals based on self-serving examples you provide while you pretend all atheists are guided by rational thought and “science” and are therefore superior to people who believe in God.

In light of how “science” has handled Covid, your contention is laughable on its face. Please explain the logic in wearing a cheap cotton mask to prevent the spread of a microscopic virus. Please explain the logic in locking down society to stop a virus that cannot be stopped because it can survive and spread through animals as well as humans. Please explain the logic of injecting children and babies with RMNA even though babies and children are at minimal risk from the virus and the injections have already been shown to not only be essentially useless but also harmful.

All of those policies were implemented based on the “science.” We have scientists to this day demanding everyone be vaccinated and some even calling for those who remain unvaccinated to be ostracized if not murdered.

What you stubbornly refuse to acknowledge is that science is just as susceptible to corruption as is religion. The fact that you point to scientific discoveries such as gravity and quantum physics while ignoring all of the errors scientists have made along the way (and are still making whether out of good faith or corruption) does not prove one thing is superior to another when it comes to what makes people happy or fulfilled.

Its also not an either or proposition. Religious people have made significant contributions to medicine, technology, mathematics and all other fields of knowledge and study.

Pretending that everyone who believes in God is some trailer park goober or Jim Baker fraudster just so you can feel superior has not convinced anyone but your own choir.

5
3
Aesop

They’re not “details”, they’re the entirety of your flaccid screed.

That you cannot come up with anything accurate is the entire point, and the dearth of anything like logic, and instead wholesale substitution of “things I don’t like which are therefore revealed truth” is why your entire eructation is naught but petulant sophomoric whining.

If you ever stumble over anything logical, I’m certain you’ll get back up, dust yourself off, and continue blundering about exactly as before.

3
2
hhluce

My PhD is in physical/organic chemistry, I know a fair amount of neuroscience (I’ve done evoked potentials research with EEG), I was part of the Quantum Theory Project at the University of Florida, so I know a fair amount about quantum theory – and inorganic chem, too, on a graduate level. Evolutionary theory doesn’t really come into this as much as abiogenesis and self-organizing systems (and I’m familiar with the work of Prof. Sidney W Fox in those areas…) The primitive creation myth in the Bible reads pretty closely onto the modern scientific creation myth of the Big Bang. When the cosmologists start talking about “symmetry breaking”, that’s when the hand-waving starts. From looking at the topic pretty intensely, and knowing the laws of thermodynamics as applied to information, I think that creation by some sort of outside source is the answer. As to that source, it’s probably ‘turtles all the way down’. Science is a way of modeling, it’s a way of explaining data, and there’s no absolute truth in science, because everything is an approximation – that Planck limit beyond which no one can go… And there are systems which can’t be modelled, too, at least you can’t get answers in finite time. The Bronze Age guys did pretty good with what they had.

2
1
hhluce

All models are *approximations*, they’re based on assumptions. They serve as a model as long as they *aren’t* wrong. When they’re wrong, as in classical physics with the ultraviolet catastrophe (see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ultraviolet_catastrophe) – you don’t get hit with a dose of hard x-rays when you open the furnace door – the models get modified, with the idea of quantization of energetic states – quantum physics. Of course, some physical models, like string theory, are essentially untestable – they’re not even wrong (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nDDJFvuFXdc)

And the same – as in Bronze Age cosmology as compared with the Big Bang – isn’t better, it’s a different way of setting out a mythology of creation.

Ironbear

is like a bronze age primitive

Hey! I resemble that!

Barry

You are the “bronze age primitive“.

kennycan

Aaaaaaaand…
Lovin’ It!

(h/t to Mel Brooks and his Get Smart character Agent 86).

hhluce

Why is it that many of the most devout Christians constantly reassure themselves of their faith, that they know it’s true, that they know everything is in God’s or Jesus’s loving hands?”

Perhaps not to reassure themselves, but to reassure others, that would be my thought. That there is a source of certainty, of eventual justice, of the Good, the True, and the Beautiful, and that we know of these things, because that source created these concepts in us – and put us here on Earth to do what we could to bring those things about in the broader society, of course, starting with ourselves. Why do slaves yearn to be free, to resist? Because they got the idea from that source, that slavery is not the true and final condition of mankind, even though the enslavers do everything in their power to make their perceptions otherwise. But waiting on God to miraculously do things, put things to right, isn’t going to happen – and has never happened. It’s what we were created for, and put here to do. We are in God’s loving hands, but it is to us to take action and to run the races that were laid out for us, and to do the things which could bring those things about.

14
8
Barry

Why is it…

There is also virtue signalling. Happens all the time.

Aesop

Clear up to yesterday, for a certainty.

Aesop

Why is it, d’ya suppose, that the self-admitted least-expert person on any given subject imagines he’s the most informed on the topic?
Is it possible that Mr. Dunning and Mr. Kruger were on to something?
That they may have, in fact, batted it out of the park, and that the OP is just another proof of their theory?

What makes someone who disdains religion to imagine that they can correctly identify the “most devout” practitioners of beliefs with which they are largely or completely ignorant?

Could it be that the people they point to and deride as the “most devout”, are, in actual fact, the least devout, and that any conclusions based on this fundamental misidentification, from total ignorance of the subject matter, are therefore necessarily completely ass-backwards, and proof of the original querent’s incompetence to even speak further on the subject?

Why, being thusly entirely ignorant of that very subject matter, do they feel some need to tout their intellectual superiority, when they manifestly know not the first thing about which they opine? Could it be that deep down, they know they themselves feel some inner need to reassure themselves that their position, arrived at in total ignorance, is clearly the smartest and most logical one, because down deep in places they seldom admit even to themselves, they know they’re just whistling past the graveyard, and need the reassurance of other pseudo-intellectuals that they’re not utter fools?

Did Copernicus take a vote on the center of the solar system?
Did Galileo recant just because the Pope and the entire Church disagreed with heliocentrism?
Or wasn’t he, in fact, content in knowing he was right, without the need to get everyone else to agree with him?

And if that’s so, isn’t it true that the most devout believer in a religion is probably the exact opposite of the one constantly having to cock-a-doodle-doo his beliefs?

And wouldn’t that mean the person that feels an irresistable need to misclassify and mischaracterize devout religious belief is the exact same kind of person, who cannot go through his life quietly content in his personal opinion, without the need to vomit up his self-importance, unbidden and unwelcome, and be nothing but an insufferable boor on topics no one asked him about in the first place?

Inquiring minds want to know.

11
3
Grumpy Oldman

Islam isn’t a religion but a political ideology masquerading as religious expression. It’s philosophy is “convert or die.”

Islam is not compatible with western civilizations and definitely has no place in the United States because we were founded on Judeo-Christian principles, which has nothing in common with Islam.

Two more undeniable truths: Epstein didn’t kill himself and the jihad squad – Ilhan Omar, Rashida Tlaib, Ayanna Presley and Alex Cortez – are domestic terrorists.

8
3
kennycan

This is why I’m an agnostic. However, I lean towards “there is a god” because it is confounding to try to understand what came before the “Big Bang” and how it resulted in such a perfectly ordered universe when chaos is its most famous trait.

Neither side can really prove the existence of, or absence of, a god.

However, since I lean towards the “there is a god” (a “Creator” so to speak since I do not believe our attempts to give human attributes to god are valid) then I find both Science, and the search for secular truths, and Theology, the search for moral truths and the answer to the question “Why?” to be equally valid and intriguing.

3
3
billo

The reason is simple, and it’s the *same* reason you and others post these kinds of articles critical of religious worldviews. One could just as easily turn your article around and ask why atheists insist on repeatedly posting statements supportive of atheism that denigrate deism.

The reason is that the only purely rational position is that of agnosticism. There is no proof of God. There is no proof there is no God. The *very* same information can be viewed from a deist viewpoint as confirmatory evidence of God *and* from an atheist viewpoint as showing there is no God. *Both* deism and atheism are choices based on incomplete information — both are acts of faith.

So, both deists and atheists build world views based on some axioms and then view everything else in a way that supports it. The deist that looks at an eagle’s wing and sees the hand of God and the atheist that looks at an eagle’s wing and sees the mysteries of “fitness” are *both* taking incomplete evidence and fitting it in — in exactly the same way.

As far at the two assertions you mention, that “My faith in God is at the center of everything I do” and “Every decision I make, I ask myself what is the best way to honor God,” the reason we Christians do this is because Christianity is, more than anything else, purpose-driven. Discipleship is a practice, a skill, and a discipline that must be learned and mastered. It’s not easy, and when done right, it is all-encompassing. The examples you describe are things that a person who is practicing that discipline would say.

It’s like anything that someone who is passionate about any discipline would say. Musicians like to talk about music. Athletes talk about their sports. Computer scientists talk about algorithms. Christians building the Christian world view and practicing Christian discipline talk about the Christ.

So, your question is analogous to saying “Why do people who follow sports keep talking about sports? Why do they enter a room and say ‘Man did you watch the Broncos yesterday? What a great game!’ I don’t walk into a room and say ‘Hey! I didn’t bother to watch any sports yesterday!”

Barry

This will have to do until Mike realizes the “Daily” is kaput…

It is Pear Harbor Day, Dec 7, 1941.

I wonder on this day, what the world would be like had the germans and japanese not decided to take over and enslave the world. There is no answer of course.

We kept the lesson for many years after, the one the Boy Scouts always taught, “Be Prepared”. We were not ready for WW2, and for that reason alone we got WW2.

We have now lost sight of that lesson. The outcome of such is known. The only question is when.

Aesop

Throwing dynamite down the outhouse just to watch the shit fly is not a Donnybrook. It’s mainly an advertisement to ignore the unasked for infomercial, and depart the area to avoid the effluvium being relocated. Grownups are generally content to move their bowels in peace and solitude, but there’s always one wiseass who craves an audience for his big splashes.

Barry

brilliant

Barry

Thanks Steve!

[…] This is on my mind this morning for two reasons. The first is this essay, which I encountered at Mike Hendrix’s place. The second is what has often been called the Problem […]

Outlier

There’s a war going on. There are many fronts – some external and some internal.
The stakes are high: people’s souls. Satan wants to take as many of them as he can.
Fear is one of his main weapons. Doubt is another.
Faith, for Christians, is both a defense and a weapon against the devil’s attacks.
But it’s not passive. It must be actively applied.
And it’s not some static, fixed thing. It ebbs and flows.
We use faith as a shield to defend and as a sword to fight.
Believers often come under strong, prolonged attacks.
Hopefully we are quickly trained, especially with promptings from our Father, to use our faith in all things.
As we mature in our faith Christians become more skilled and experienced in spiritual fighting.
When you hear Christians asserting their faith you’re hearing the sounds of battle.
It might be a minor skirmish (e.g., God, please, give me patience).
It might be a snippet from a terrible struggle (addiction, porn, unforgiveness, broken relationship) in a long, deep, dark valley.
We try to walk by faith in all things.

kennycan

Praise the Lord and Pass the Ammunition.

Unfortunately we are at that stage where Patience is out and Action is in.

Outlier

That’s a great example. 

How do you know who to shoot? When? Where?

Christians are bound by the 11 commandments (original 10 plus one “new commandment I give unto you”).

That last one is a game-changer. God saved us “while we were yet sinners.”  What if some of the “bad guys” just doesn’t know any better? A bullet-type solution is final with no second chances. As Christians we are required to live by a different set of rules – Godly rules not carnal.

For example, “When I say unto the wicked, Thou shalt surely die; and thou givest him not warning, nor speakest to warn the wicked from his wicked way, to save his life; the same wicked man shall die in his iniquity; but his blood will I require at thine hand.” -Ezekiel 3:18

As you can see, we have to give a warning. We have to at least try. Otherwise we’ve stepped over the line and now we’ll be in big trouble.

And what if one of bad guys asks for forgiveness? Well, we have to forgive if we want to be forgiven (another one of those Godly rules).
Also we could easily be on the other side if not for God’s grace. Most (hopefully all) Christians have at least one experience where we know, beyond any doubts, that God spared us big time when we deserved to get the hammer dropped on us hard. That type of thing brings humility or at least it should. God does stuff like that all the time. After an experience like that we start connecting the dots and realize something bigger is going on.  The light bulb goes on and we start thinking, “Hmmm, there’s some important lessons in that.” For may of us that’s the beginning of wisdom.

Later, if we keep trying and exercising/asserting our faith, God starts to build on those lessons. We willingly start to look for and then follow His guidance.  Sometimes God allows us to enter into very challenging situations that may be very painful so we can learn some difficult lessons. He’s looking at the long term.  He loves us the just the way we are but He also loves us too much to let us stay that way. We need to grow spiritually.  

So what do we do? We have to have faith and lots and lots of it. The worse the situation then the more faith we need especially when we are hurting. When we are in pain or worried or frightened it’s easy to take our eyes off of God and start looking at the world like we used to.  
Just like Peter when he stepped out of the boat. He took his eyes off of Jesus and *plunk* into the water he went. But as soon as he cried out “immediately” Jesus was there.  

I used to think that God was only for big problems and emergencies.
I kept Him back like a fire extinguisher behind glass (break in case of emergency). Years ago I started to realized I needed Him for medium problems.  And then I figured out He’d help with the small stuff. Now I try to include Him in every part of my life. It’s not easy, especially when He brings out the pruning shears, but I can’t imagine living life now the way I used to.  

I wish I could go back in time and talk to my younger self.
I wish someone had explained to me all the things I know now.
I can’t believe I used to go through the day (or even a week) without talking to God. So sad. I’m not where I want to be but thank God I’m not where I was.

God bless you.

kennycan

How did the Patriots know?

Christians must learn to recognize Evil and those who fight on their side.

That’s why Praise the Lord comes first.

Fighting evil is self defense.

Jesus warned against drawing the sword not because the sword is wrong. It’s because his destiny was to be taken, be tried and die on the cross for our sins. The idea that Jesus was against violence because of the Story of the Betrayal has been willfully misconstrued. Jesus drove the money changers from the Temple.

Last edited 11 months ago by kennycan

Recent Comments

Comments policy

Comments appear entirely at the whim of the guy who pays the bills for this site and may be deleted, ridiculed, maliciously edited for purposes of mockery, or otherwise pissed over as he in his capricious fancy sees fit. The CF comments section is pretty free-form and rough and tumble; tolerance level for rowdiness and misbehavior is fairly high here, but is NOT without limit. Management is under no obligation whatever to allow the comments section to be taken over and ruined by trolls, Leftists, and/or other oxygen thieves, and will take any measures deemed necessary to prevent such. Conduct yourself with the merest modicum of decorum, courtesy, and respect and you'll be fine. Pick pointless squabbles with other commenters, fling provocative personal insults, issue threats, or annoy the host (me) and...you won't. Should you find yourself sanctioned after running afoul of the CF comments policy as stated and feel you have been wronged, please download and complete the Butthurt Report form below in quadruplicate; retain one copy for your personal records and send the others to the email address posted in the right sidebar. Please refrain from whining, sniveling, and/or bursting into tears and waving your chubby fists around in frustrated rage, lest you suffer an aneurysm or stroke unnecessarily. Your completed form will be reviewed and your complaint addressed whenever management feels like getting around to it. Thank you.

Categories

Archives

"Mike Hendrix is, without a doubt, the greatest one-legged blogger in the world." ‐Henry Chinaski

Subscribe to CF!

Support options

Shameless begging

If you enjoy the site, please consider donating:

Allied territory

Alternatives to shitlib social media:

Fuck you

Kill one for mommy today! Click to embiggen

Notable Quotes

"America is at that awkward stage. It's too late to work within the system, but too early to shoot the bastards."
Claire Wolfe, 101 Things to Do 'Til the Revolution

Claire's Cabal—The Freedom Forums

FREEDOM!!!

"There are men in all ages who mean to govern well, but they mean to govern. They promise to be good masters, but they mean to be masters."
Daniel Webster

“A slave is one who waits for someone to come and free him.”
Ezra Pound

“The illusion of freedom will continue as long as it’s profitable to continue the illusion. At the point where the illusion becomes too expensive to maintain, they will just take down the scenery, they will pull back the curtains, they will move the tables and chairs out of the way and you will see the brick wall at the back of the theater.”
Frank Zappa

“The right of a nation to kill a tyrant in case of necessity can no more be doubted than to hang a robber, or kill a flea.”
John Adams

"A society of sheep must in time beget a government of wolves."
Bertrand de Jouvenel

"It is terrible to contemplate how few politicians are hanged."
GK Chesterton

"I predict that the Bush administration will be seen by freedom-wishing Americans a generation or two hence as the hinge on the cell door locking up our freedom. When my children are my age, they will not be free in any recognizably traditional American meaning of the word. I’d tell them to emigrate, but there’s nowhere left to go. I am left with nauseating near-conviction that I am a member of the last generation in the history of the world that is minimally truly free."
Donald Surber

"The only way to live free is to live unobserved."
Etienne de la Boiete

"History does not long entrust the care of freedom to the weak or the timid."
Dwight D. Eisenhower

"To put it simply, the Left is the stupid and the insane, led by the evil. You can’t persuade the stupid or the insane and you had damn well better fight the evil."
Skeptic

"There is no better way to stamp your power on people than through the dead hand of bureaucracy. You cannot reason with paperwork."
David Black, from Turn Left For Gibraltar

"If the laws of God and men, are therefore of no effect, when the magistracy is left at liberty to break them; and if the lusts of those who are too strong for the tribunals of justice, cannot be otherwise restrained than by sedition, tumults and war, those seditions, tumults and wars, are justified by the laws of God and man."
John Adams

"The limits of tyranny are prescribed by the endurance of those whom they oppress."
Frederick Douglass

"Give me the media and I will make of any nation a herd of swine."
Joseph Goebbels

“I hope we once again have reminded people that man is not free unless government is limited. There’s a clear cause and effect here that is as neat and predictable as a law of physics: As government expands, liberty contracts.”
Ronald Reagan

"Ain't no misunderstanding this war. They want to rule us and aim to do it. We aim not to allow it. All there is to it."
NC Reed, from Parno's Peril

"I just want a government that fits in the box it originally came in."
Bill Whittle

Best of the best

Image swiped from The Last Refuge

2016 Fabulous 50 Blog Awards

RSS feed

RSS - entries - Entries
RSS - entries - Comments

Contact


mike at this URL dot com

All e-mails assumed to be legitimate fodder for publication, scorn, ridicule, or other public mockery unless otherwise specified

Boycott the New York Times -- Read the Real News at Larwyn's Linx

Copyright © 2022