Welcome to Ye Olde Colde Furye Blogge’s shiny new open-comments thread, where y’all can have at it as you wish, on any topic you like. Do note that the official CF comments policy remains in effect here, as enumerated in the left sidebar. All new posts will appear below this one. There will be blood…
Glad to see I’m not the only one noticing:
DeSantis just keeps digging a deeper anti Freedom and Liberty hole. DeSantis is the gov of Florida, the place the feds raided Trumps home. Crickets from the gov on that, crickets. And now nothing to be said about an attack on “MAGA” republicans.
If you don’t understand how this works you better start boning up because they, the GOPe, are coming to Fuck you once again. DeSantis is the Bush approved candidate. The McConnell candidate.Ever hear DeSantis say anything about Romney? Ever wonder why? And just who was DeSantis meeting with out in Utah a month or so back? And why is it a “secret”?
DeSantis has made a few remarks about the raid being wrong.
He’s the Governor of FL. His DOJ should have been instituting an investigation into how a FL citizen was subjected to an Unconstitutional search and seizure when the warrant had not been produced.
He should demand that they immediately show him the warrant and any other documentation related to getting the warrant approved.
At the very least.
Yea, damn few. He should have been closing down FBI office throughout the state.
I’m hearing that DeSantis is on Fox to finally say something about the biden hitler speech last night.
Chengdu shutdown. I have a customer there.
Beats the hell out of me what is really going on in China. My guess, civil unrest is so bad that the shutdowns are to keep the population under control.
And/Or purges and beefing up security and intimidating people before they have to take the inevitable steps to close down the teetering banks.
Identify elements that would rebel. Purge them. Intimidate the rest. “Look at what we can do if you go against us”.
That could be it. People disappear all the time and no one asks why because they fear they will be next.
HK on a larger scale perhaps.
Intimidation and purges takes different forms as the ChiComs see fit.
In HK local police were replaced with mainland military posing as HK Police. They had no compunctions about using violence to beat to death a number of people on the subway trains in the New Territory. From there the violence escalated on both sides. But the ChiComs accepted that as they used surveillance to identify and track the leaders. They finally identified the “home base” in HK University. During that siege a lot of people “disappeared”. Once that phase was over they went after people like Jimmy Lai, owner of Apple Daily. Trumped up charges and abduction. Now jail time. Most of the Pro-democracy politicians were also arrested. But billionaires like Li Ka Shing were taken aside and told they needed to keep something like 25% of their wealth over or face losing it all. He did that and then sold everything in the mainland and invested in Europe. He had been moving money out of China/Hong Kong for years before that.
This is probably just another method of intimidation, shakedown, purging and “disappearing” presented by the fortuitous “accidental” release of WuFlu from…somewhere, but not Wuhan. It’s just Covid-19 (I hope one gets the sarcasm of that last part).
I’m happy I’m not the only one that thinks the whole “Q” thing is a government deep state operation:
I admit to thinking talk of the government being involved with the 9/11 take down of the towers being tin foil level thinking.
Over the last several years I’ve been thinking, with everything else they have done, maybe so. This comment sums up my current feelings about the subject:
I think the FBI/CIA had an idea.kf what they were planning and just allowed it to proceed.
First there was the first WTC attack. They knew the plans were to take down at.least.kne Tower. Plus Khalid Sheikh Mohammed was involved in that.
Later Khalid was working in the Philippines on a potential attack with some of the others involved on 9/11. Bojinka was broken up with the help of Phillipines but the plotters escaped. But the plans were discovered. They included the idea of hijacking airliners in Asia and using them as missiles to hit cities in Asia.
Then there was Moussaoui in custody and they wanted to break into his computer. He was picked up because he was taking flight lessons and suspiciously couldn’t care less about how to land. Several others involved were reported as well. Yet the DC office fought tooth and nail to keep them from breaking into his computer, even though he was not even a US Citizen.
Finally there is what I noticed right away that day or the next. The 19 hijackers were identified, they had dossiers in the news about them, they knew exactly how they were in the country and it was obvious they were “on the radar” of the intelligence services already.
So if they’re watching these guys, and given the knowledge they have of Sheik Mohammed and Bojinka, why did they protect that laptop? Sounds more like how they tried to protect Hunter’s Laptop for as long as possible.
I also have always believed the TWA800 explosion over Long Island was a terrorist attack and was covered up.
Then there’s the TX Mohammed Drawings attacks in which the FBI agents were right there watching it, and rumors the FBI guy drove them there.
So my trust in our government has only made all these things much more suspicious over the years.
Oh, and then there was the OK City bombing where the rumors have always been that McVeigh had Islamic operatives helping.
“…and rumors the FBI guy drove them there.”
I think that is fact, not rumor. Just as we know there were contacts with the McVeigh group with islamic terrorists.
TWA800, very suspicious, but I don’t know.
The leadup to 9/11 can be explained as an issue of compartmentalization, as it was explained. I just don’t believe it anymore.
I’m uncertain, but I think it more than likely the government helped the 9/11 hijackers along, just like the helped the Jan 6 political prisoners along and the Whitmer kidnapping plot along.
IOW’s, given what we know now, it’s way more than likely 9/11 was a US government inside job. I may have to search for some tinfoil now.
heh, I accidentally upvoted my own comment, so I downvoted it to balance the ledger 🙂
You could have just admitted to it.
Cold Fury commenters moral compass mostly point true north.
I remember TWA800 vividly. It was a weekend evening on a perfect summer day, not a cloud in the sky, no wind to speak of and basically perfect flying conditions. It was still light out!
Basically every commerical jet accident before that had either been bad weather or terrorism.
The news immediately coming out was 100s of eyewitnesses out walking on a beautiful summer evening, looking up at the sky and watching airplanes head on out and all of a sudden seeing a ground to air flash upwards and then boom. Then the plane falling from the sky. As a long time resident there I can tell you, people watched the airplanes, beautiful and bird like, cross the lovely blue skies all the time on a nice summers eve.
The FBI tried to convince people that what 100s of people saw, from all sorts of angles, from East looking West and West looking East, and from the South Shore to the North Shore of Long Island, was a massive optical illusion.
There’s something totally BS about it.
Especially the fact the NTSB investigation was immediately taken over by the FBI and the NTSB was never allowed.to interview.the eyewitnesses directly. all the refutations of the eyewitness testimony came from the FBI and their ludicrous theory that the “ground to air” middle.like appearances was simply the plane “exploding upwards”.
I don’t doubt it was terror activity or the other claim, our own Navy accidentally shot it down. I just don’t really know.
This guy’s story seems plausible. He’s an ex-navy man who seems knowledgeable and legit. He says a new radar system was being tested. His ship locked onto the plane but through a major screwup a sister ship launched a missile at the plane.
I was *forced* into thinking about TWA800 all morning. I’ve not read anything further, just recalling my conclusions way back when, and why.
The Navy didn’t shoot it down. No way to hide that from the entire crew on board at least one ship, plus others observing. No way they could have kept that under wraps, and in all this time not one Seaman has cracked and spilled the beans? Nope, wasn’t a Navy missile.
A terrorist maybe? Not normal for terrorists to blow things up and not claim the credit. Possible, unlikely as hell. Plus, the terror hunters are not all deep state corrupted people. Keeping them quiet is a problem. Nope, I don’t think it was a terrorist.
Which leaves us with an exploding gas tank, and the engineering at that time leads me to find it entirely plausible.
Sometimes accidents happen.
How many flight hours did those planes fly with the same configuration? What changes were instituted? Why wasn’t the whole fleet grounded until the fix was made?
How do you explain the hundreds of eyewitnesses who, on a clear summer evening, when the sun stays out until well past the time in question, and viewed from different angles and distances, all saw a ground to air contrail like a missile rise up and set off the explosion of the plane?
That’s one of the key points. In inclement weather with high winds there are no eyewitnesses. But this was a clear sky, little wind, and high visibility and hundreds of people saw it. I was 50 miles west and about 40 miles south and enjoying the balmy evening outdoors with family right at that moment, so I can confirm the weather conditions and visibility. We could easily see the planes taking off from Kennedy.
“How many flight hours did those planes fly with the same configuration?”
Irrelevant. Shit happens. Sometimes it’s a once in a blue moon failure. Sometimes, as here, it has happened before. This wasn’t the first time, just the first time in a 747.
“What changes were instituted?”
They could never be certain what caused the fuel (empty – fumes) in the center tank to explode. The theory was some bad wiring. I don’t recall that any changes were made.
“Why wasn’t the whole fleet grounded until the fix was made?”
Because that almost never happens unless it is clear that a systemic problem is the culprit. Even then they are usually given time to effect repairs. That’s the way it works.
“How do you explain the hundreds of eyewitnesses who, on a clear summer evening, when the sun stays out until well past the time in question, and viewed from different angles and distances, all saw a ground to air contrail like a missile rise up and set off the explosion of the plane?”
A leading question. Eyewitness accounts are notoriously unreliable. Also, the same phenomena that led to a potentially inaccurate report would have been the same for all viewers.
The NTSB report made it clear weather conditions were good. That has never been in question.
Shit happens. Airplanes blow up, airplanes crash. It’s not always terror related or a government plot or mistake.
I’m only making the case that it’s a stretch to suggest anything else as it requires way too many people to be in on the “plot”. And a quarter century later none, not one, has talked.
Explain that and give an example of a large conspiracy that was kept quiet for a quarter century and I’ll put some credence in it.
One of the better articles:
Hundreds of eyewitnesses who all saw the same thing?
Also, as I mentioned, The FBI refused to allow the NTSB to interview them. The FBI alone interviewed them and refused to allow anyone else to see the interviews.
Now, give me an example of a plane that had flown for over a decade suddenly failing in a way that killed all aboard that wasn’t weather or terrorist related.
Those were 737s.
TWA800 was a 747-131 built July, 1971.
Also, two pictures seem to be the same plane. Another seems to be TWA800 being put back together after.
There’s no way to know either way. But in hindsight given what we know about the FBI and terrorists/terrorism it does make me go Hmmmmm…
Oh and then explain how right after 9/11 that plane took off from Kennedy and “shook apart in turbulence” over Far Rockaway on another clear, windless day.
A few weeks or so later the shoe bomber tried to down a plane. Then there was the underwear bomber.
Also, recall the anthrax attacks, the DC snipers, all occured in that time frame.
We were discussing the possible Islamic Terrorism aspect of the OK City bombings as well.
Plus we know there’s something awfully fishy about the Vegas Massacre.
Add in the Known Wolves attacks in Orlando and San Bernardino as well. Why should we believe they were really lone wolf attacks?
Yes, shit happens. But there is a pattern of the real shit that happened having FBI/CIA fingerprints on them going on decades now.
So, TWA800 was downed because other terrorist activities occurred?
I’ve been in planes over the mid Atlantic that shook violently and unexpectedly in perfectly clear weather. I personally know pilots, retired now, that can tell you all kinds of stories about unexpected turbulence. That happens if you fly enough.
Everything is not a terror attack.
The FBI, as corrupt as they are, also was investigating this as a possible terror act, and because of that the witness reports were withheld. Nothing nefarious about that, it’s routine. The NTSB basically said the witness’s were wrong, what they saw was not a missile.
Anything is possible. But I don’t believe TWA800 was anything more than one of a handful of planes that have blown up as a result of flying with an empty tank.
You can find no definitive proof to say otherwise. You can believe anything you wish. But that’s all it is, a belief.
A pattern of covering up for their failure to detect these terrorists or worse, failure to stop known wolves.
Let me just give a hypothetical. What if the shoe bomber hadn’t been stopped by other passengers and succeeded in downing the plane immediately.
Do you think they would have said “well, someone appears to have snuck a bomb aboard the plane despite all our screening procedures. We don’t know how they did it, but don’t worry, air travel is safe”.
Or would they try to find a mechanical or pilot error explanation even though there were no indications of such. No mayday calls. Likewise with TWA800 there were 100s of eyewitnesses to a missile fired. Would they have admitted terrorism at the time? Remember, after WTC 1 they claimed they were keeping us safe. OR, if it were the Navy would they have admitted. Remember it’s BJ Clinton in charge. He lies about everything.
We started this thread talking about how the FBI (and most likely the CIA) have known about every significant terrorist attack as Known Wolves ever since 9/11. We also spoke about how there were things that should have tripped major red flags about 9/11 and the oddity of not getting at Moussaoui’s computer when the field.office wanted.
We also agreed that there were signs that McVeigh had contacts with Islamics before the bombing.
We will never truly be sure, but the TWA800 and Rockaway crashes have similar suspicious things about them.
Questions. Do you think two Islamic Jihadis going on a sniper rampage in DC was a Jihadi cell activated to amplify the 9/11 terror? Were the anthrax attacks coming from Islamic Terrorists? I answer yes to both.
Add in the shoe bomber and then the underwear bomber in that window and there appears to have been a coordinated effort to keep America terrified of Islamic attacks on the Homeland. So, how can the Rockaway crash be dismissed as POSSIBLY a terror attack; a shoe bomber or underwear bomber for instance.
Have they released the original interviews raw now? If it is not terrorism it doesn’t seem to make any difference to national security to keep them secret now.
IIRC some details of the supposed eyewitness sightings were released, such as location when witness sighted them. Also some reporters spoke with people who confirmed they had seen something.
But I never remember seeing anything about the actual eyewitness accounts of what they said they saw at the time of the interview were released.